We keep hearing about solid-state batteries being developed, with companies like CATL planning limited production around 2027. I know there are big challenges with things like cycle life, but has anyone built a full pack with these prototype cells yet?
If not, what’s holding them back from building a test pack and putting it in a vehicle? A real-world test would make the tech feel a lot more real than it does now.
Mercedes is supposed to start road testing solid-state battery packs in a few months, so I assume they have packs ready. Here’s a link: Mercedes testing solid-state batteries soon.
@jessicah
Expect delays. The original goal was for 2030, so it could easily get pushed back even more.
The real issue isn’t building it, it’s building it at scale for an affordable price.
Robert said:
The real issue isn’t building it, it’s building it at scale for an affordable price.
There are also plenty of technical issues to work out.
CATL mentioned they’re still figuring out how to manufacture solid-state cells. They have a huge team of engineers, but it’s still a major challenge.
jabali said:
CATL mentioned they’re still figuring out how to manufacture solid-state cells. They have a huge team of engineers, but it’s still a major challenge.
I still think CATL will be the first to make it happen. They’re super ambitious.
@jeff
Yeah, here’s some info: CATL is working on 20Ah sample cells and moving toward a pilot stage before full-scale production, which could take a few years. They aim for small-scale production by 2027. But keep in mind, when these hit the market, they’ll likely be really expensive, probably limited to high-end or specialty EVs at first.
Toyota actually tested a solid-state prototype years ago, even using it in a showcase at the Tokyo Olympics. Most prototypes are kept secret until they’re near production-ready. It’s possible there are test vehicles out there now without anyone knowing since they could fit within existing pack designs.
@Michael
Prime Planet Energy & Solutions (the Toyota-Panasonic joint venture) is working on this. They’re a serious player with thousands of employees, but I’d still keep expectations realistic.
jabali said:
@Michael
Prime Planet Energy & Solutions (the Toyota-Panasonic joint venture) is working on this. They’re a serious player with thousands of employees, but I’d still keep expectations realistic.
It’s worth noting that Prime Planet isn’t starting from scratch. They inherited R&D and facilities from Toyota and Panasonic. Their factory in Himeji even still has Panasonic branding on it, so it’s a big operation. In fact, if you buy a Lexus RZ today, it uses Prime Planet batteries.
MG (under SAIC) announced they’ll release a car with a solid-state battery in early 2025. Read more here.
@sorphia
Sounds more like a semi-solid-state battery since they mentioned a 5% liquid content in the design.
From what I’ve seen, a lot of the so-called ‘solid-state’ cells aren’t fully solid. They’re using a gel electrolyte, like what Factorial is working on. Stellantis is supposed to demo some of these next year. True solid-state cells, like Factorial’s ‘Solstice’ line, are much further from production. Even demo packs are made from hand-built cells, which could cost $10K per kWh, so scaling down to $100/kWh could still take a decade.
@MAKENA
What’s the energy density on Factorial’s gel cells? If it’s high and stable, it could still be worth it.
Building ‘a solid-state pack’ isn’t the hard part. Any well-funded team can do that. Making millions of safe, affordable, and high-performing packs that can compete with today’s batteries—that’s the challenge.
There are also niche uses, like drones, where solid-state tech might work even with limitations.
One of the big issues is the solid part—solid-state cells are more brittle, so they might crack if you hit a pothole.
diallo said:
One of the big issues is the solid part—solid-state cells are more brittle, so they might crack if you hit a pothole.
Not sure why this is getting downvoted. The brittleness of ceramic separators is a real concern.
@Jason
It’s a valid concern, but it’s more of an obstacle for using solid-state batteries in EVs than for building them in the first place.
@Jason
Imagine people who like lowering their cars for looks and then end up with road debris hitting the battery!